To root canal or not to root canal; bad dentist?

Discussion in 'Dental Archive' started by R, Mar 5, 2004.

  1. R

    R Guest

    Heya... I have a question. Normally I just take the dentist's
    advice without much question, but this one has be scratching my head.

    It all started about a year ago. The dentist found a cavity in #14.
    Nothing special in the Xrays, so he set up an appointment to fill it
    in 3 weeks. 3 weeks later, he fills it, but discovers that it is much
    deeper than he thought. He ends up drilling all the way down to one
    of the roots, putting in some kind of insulant and filling. All was
    well in my mouth.

    About 5 months after this, I begin to have increasing and then
    extreme sensitivity to hot and cold in #14. It was "symptomatic"; the
    pain would last well past the initial hot/cold event that caused it,
    and sometimes would wake me up in the middle of the night with
    throbbing pain. I mentioned all this to him at my 6 month cleaning.
    During the cleaning he discovered that #18 (or whichever tooth it is
    that is tooth directly beneath #14) had a cracked filling. (The
    filling was old... I've had it for around 15 years.) He set me up to
    get it fixed a couple of weeks later. He fixed it and discovered that
    it was cracked because he got the bite incorrect when he filled #14;
    i.e., the filling on #14 was coming down hard on and eventually broke
    the filling in #18. So he fixed the fillings on #14 and #18. While
    he did #18, he told his assistant (who is a 17 year old high school
    kid... is that normal?!) to mark down that the existing filling was
    very deep... right down to the root again. He tests #14's sensitivity
    and sends me off to the Endo.

    The Endo did a watch and wait on #14; the nerve weasn't dead, and it
    seemed to be recovering somewhat. On the second follow-up, I
    mentioned to her that it's begun to hurt when I chew with the tooth.
    She tested it and found that it is fractured.

    For #14, I am told by my endo that I have three options: nothing,
    crown, or root canal with crown. Obviously I need to do something,
    the tooth is fractured. But do I need a root canal? The endo says
    that this makes sense in a conservative way, as the crown will just
    decrease the insulation that the heat/cold has from the nerve, and if
    the nerve dies, they will have to do a root canal through the crown,
    which is not optimal. So thus far, I've opted for the root canal. Is
    this a smart choice? (I've never had one before, so I'm a bit twitchy
    about getting one. I've never heard anyone say they enjoyed their
    root canal. ;))

    Lastly, now #18 is beginning to show extreme sensitivity to
    hot/cold. I haven't seen the Endo yet, but I will bring it up to her
    when I go in for the root canal in a couple of weeks.

    What I also want to know is: did my dentist err? (I know all
    dentists err from time to time, but if he did, I'll be heading to
    another dentist, as this particular err will be very expensive for
    me). Is it possible #14 cracked because he screwed up the bite? (It
    was impacting #18 hard... hard enough to crack the filling). Since it
    took 5 months for the pain to manifest in #14, I'm wondering if maybe
    the tooth was fine after the first filling, then eventually fractured,
    causing the heat sensitivity and need for a root canal. (I'm not a
    dentist, so I don't know if this scenario makes sense, but Occam's
    Razor seems to like it.) Now that #18 is hurting (around 2 months
    after it was re-filled), I'm guessing that this, too, is related to
    his screwing up the bite and the need to re-fill it.

    Is it common for dentists to make these kinds of errors? Is it
    normal to wait a few weeks to do work on a cavity or a cracked filling
    that they discover in a check-up? My dentist is nice guy and seems
    competent when he is working on me, but his results in this particular
    case have me shaking my head.

    Thanks,

    -R
     
    R, Mar 5, 2004
    #1
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  2. REPLY

    Me too,,,, I mean I used to do that!
    Happens ....
    Yeowwwwwwww!

    PARAFUNCTION of the nerve ....... scratch that. Not so.


    lower left 2nd molar (12 year molar)
    Mebbe .........
    Hah. I love it!

    Is she hot? Then I will tell you .......
    No crown on it right?

    Post x-ray. Any digital x-ray-ologists among your doctors? If so
    e-mail it to me!

    Yeah, ,,,,,,

    But why the hesitancy on the endodontist's part?


    No in fact many people love getting root canal therapy .......

    There is a website for that ......... S/M I think .......
    Ahhh, lady endo.........

    As opposed to laddy endo .........
    To err, is to err,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

    Actually Occam WAS a dentist ............. or was it a barber?
    Yup.

    His big err was in opening HIS mouth.

    --
    Joel M. Eichen, .
    Philadelphia PA

    DISCLAIMER FOLLOWS:

    *********

    Dental health-related material
    is provided for information purposes
    only and does not necessarily
    represent endorsement by or an official
    position of the SciMedDentistry gang
    or any other official agency either
    actual or fictitious or Steve Mancuso.

    Advice on the treatment or care
    of an individual patient should
    be obtained through consultation
    with a dentist who has examined
    that patient or is familiar with
    that patient's dental history.

    STANDARD DISCLAIMER
     
    Joel M. Eichen D.D.S., Mar 5, 2004
    #2
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  3. R

    Dr. Steve Guest

    Not possible to break the lower tooth because the upper tooth is too thick.

    If you cracked the lower tooth, it either had an enormous amount of decay in
    it, or you clench and isometrically grind your teeth at night while
    sleeping.

    --
    `~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~
    Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S.
    Troy, Michigan USA
    =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
    ..
     
    Dr. Steve, Mar 5, 2004
    #3
  4. So are you saying that root canal treatment is pizin?


    JOEL

    --
    Joel M. Eichen, .
    Philadelphia PA

    DISCLAIMER FOLLOWS:

    *********

    Dental health-related material
    is provided for information purposes
    only and does not necessarily
    represent endorsement by or an official
    position of the SciMedDentistry gang
    or any other official agency either
    actual or fictitious or Steve Mancuso.

    Advice on the treatment or care
    of an individual patient should
    be obtained through consultation
    with a dentist who has examined
    that patient or is familiar with
    that patient's dental history.

    STANDARD DISCLAIMER
     
    Joel M. Eichen D.D.S., Mar 5, 2004
    #4
  5. R

    DanceRat Guest

    DanceRat, Mar 6, 2004
    #5
  6. They are pizin, well according to Jan they are ......


    On 5 Mar 2004 16:41:22 -0800, (DanceRat)
    wrote:
    --
    Joel M. Eichen, .
    Philadelphia PA

    DISCLAIMER FOLLOWS:

    *********

    Dental health-related material
    is provided for information purposes
    only and does not necessarily
    represent endorsement by or an official
    position of the SciMedDentistry gang
    or any other official agency either
    actual or fictitious or Steve Mancuso.

    Advice on the treatment or care
    of an individual patient should
    be obtained through consultation
    with a dentist who has examined
    that patient or is familiar with
    that patient's dental history.

    STANDARD DISCLAIMER
     
    Joel M. Eichen D.D.S., Mar 6, 2004
    #6
  7. Kaiser Wilhelm or Kaiser Soze .....?



    Wait. So far, so good. He's telling you that at a minimum you'll
    need a
    root canal. But first, he would have to establish if the tooth is
    restorable at all. X-rays don't always tell the entire story, so
    about the
    only way to find out the extent of the decay is to go in and remove it
    all.
    Only then can a reliable determination be made...on these questionable
    teeth, mind you.






    On 5 Mar 2004 16:41:22 -0800, (DanceRat)
    wrote:
    --
    Joel M. Eichen, .
    Philadelphia PA

    DISCLAIMER FOLLOWS:

    *********

    Dental health-related material
    is provided for information purposes
    only and does not necessarily
    represent endorsement by or an official
    position of the SciMedDentistry gang
    or any other official agency either
    actual or fictitious or Steve Mancuso.

    Advice on the treatment or care
    of an individual patient should
    be obtained through consultation
    with a dentist who has examined
    that patient or is familiar with
    that patient's dental history.

    STANDARD DISCLAIMER
     
    Joel M. Eichen D.D.S., Mar 6, 2004
    #7
  8. R

    WB Guest


    Kaiser Sose, aka Verbal

    Great movie.
     
    WB, Mar 6, 2004
    #8
  9. WB wrote:
    Would you like some smiley sauce with that?

    Steve
     
    Steven Bornfeld, Mar 6, 2004
    #9
  10. R

    widget Guest

    says...
    His post said the upper tooth cracked the filling in the lower tooth
    because the filling in the upper tooth caused his bite to be off.

    Learn to read, DUMBASS.
     
    widget, Mar 6, 2004
    #10
  11. R

    Dr. Steve Guest

    Are you referring to me?

    --
    `~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~
    Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S.
    Troy, Michigan USA
    =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
    ..
     
    Dr. Steve, Mar 6, 2004
    #11
  12. R

    R Guest

    On Fri, 05 Mar 2004 13:20:13 -0500, Joel M. Eichen D.D.S.

    Hmm... that'd suck if I grind my teeth in my sleep, as I sure as
    heck don't know how to tell myself to knock it off when I'm
    unconcious...
    LOL. I believe she would be called "jail bait".
    Nope... the tooth is just a tooth with a big ol' filling in it.
    (Well, it's not that big, according to the endo.)
    Yeah, the endo has digital x-rays (an awesome technology if you ask
    me!). She told me the tooth didn't appear to look abnormal under
    X-ray. This is part of why she did the "watchful waiting" thing after
    she tested the tooth... apparently the nerve wasn't infected, just
    irritated, probably because the nerve is so close to the filling.
    According to her, it would either get better or worse... either the
    tooth would narrow the nerve canals a bit to insulate itself or the
    nerve would die and I'd need a root canal. Then she found the
    fracture on the second visit and she changed her reccomendation to
    "get the root canal and a crown".

    First time she checked it, the nerve wasn't infected or dead, the
    tooth was... heh... unbelieveably responsive to cold, but the pain
    didn't persist abnormally long. She figured that if she kept checking
    up on me every month or so (no cost... free return visits), either the
    tooth would get better or go south.
    Stab me! Stab me repeatedly in the tooth! Oooh!

    Cool... that's a relief.

    Oh, I dunno... given the comments here, I think I'll cut him some
    slack, since most of my woes apparently have nothing to do with his
    work. He may have hosed the bite on #14 and that may have messed up
    the filling on #18, but all is forgiven if he's not the reason why I'm
    getting to know the endo so well...

    -R
     
    R, Mar 6, 2004
    #12
  13. Could you call her and ask her to e-mail it somewhere "for a second
    opinion."


    JOEL

    The x-ray, not the 17-year old.


    --
    Joel M. Eichen, .
    Philadelphia PA

    DISCLAIMER FOLLOWS:

    *********

    Dental health-related material
    is provided for information purposes
    only and does not necessarily
    represent endorsement by or an official
    position of the SciMedDentistry gang
    or any other official agency either
    actual or fictitious or Steve Mancuso.

    Advice on the treatment or care
    of an individual patient should
    be obtained through consultation
    with a dentist who has examined
    that patient or is familiar with
    that patient's dental history.

    STANDARD DISCLAIMER
     
    Joel M. Eichen D.D.S., Mar 6, 2004
    #13
  14. says...
    Any moron can learn to hand stuff to the dentist. The time to worry is
    when the moron sits on the dentist's chair and starts doing stuff in
    your mouth.
     
    Ol' Doc Parker, Mar 6, 2004
    #14
  15. says...
    Actually, 16 is the legal fornication age in some jurisdictions in the
    USA.

    I could be that more than just teeth are getting drilled in that
    dentist's office.
     
    Ol' Doc Parker, Mar 6, 2004
    #15
  16. On Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:06:55 -0500, Ol' Doc Parker
    You said, "I could be ........"

    WHOT????? You gonna be in BIG trouble Ol' Doc Parker. You are too old
    for that.

    --
    Joel M. Eichen, .
    Philadelphia PA

    DISCLAIMER FOLLOWS:

    *********

    Dental health-related material
    is provided for information purposes
    only and does not necessarily
    represent endorsement by or an official
    position of the SciMedDentistry gang
    or any other official agency either
    actual or fictitious or Steve Mancuso.

    Advice on the treatment or care
    of an individual patient should
    be obtained through consultation
    with a dentist who has examined
    that patient or is familiar with
    that patient's dental history.

    STANDARD DISCLAIMER
     
    Joel M. Eichen D.D.S., Mar 6, 2004
    #16
  17. On Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:00:14 -0500, Ol' Doc Parker
    REPLY

    This is funny. I hope no dental assistants are reading this!
    REPLY

    Which moron are we talking about ... I lost track.

    --
    Joel M. Eichen, .
    Philadelphia PA

    DISCLAIMER FOLLOWS:

    *********

    Dental health-related material
    is provided for information purposes
    only and does not necessarily
    represent endorsement by or an official
    position of the SciMedDentistry gang
    or any other official agency either
    actual or fictitious or Steve Mancuso.

    Advice on the treatment or care
    of an individual patient should
    be obtained through consultation
    with a dentist who has examined
    that patient or is familiar with
    that patient's dental history.

    STANDARD DISCLAIMER
     
    Joel M. Eichen D.D.S., Mar 6, 2004
    #17
  18. R

    Lets Connect Guest

    Yes... apparently, in the 1930s, the planet's rabbit population nearly
    got wiped out due to root canals... every single victim was found to
    have a root-canaled tooth implanted under their fur... definitive
    proof that root canals are poison (unfortunately, since rabbits have
    become a protected species, it has been impossible to replicate
    Price's extremely important findings... the World Wildlife Fund has a
    lot to answer for!)



     
    Lets Connect, Mar 6, 2004
    #18
  19. R

    Tony Bad Guest

    That was his theory, but a filling that is "off" will rarely break an opposing
    tooth unless that tooth is compromised or there are forces other than normal
    chewing forces at work.

    Try to learn to be civil, especially when you don't know what you are talking
    about.

    T
     
    Tony Bad, Mar 6, 2004
    #19
  20. R

    StovePipe Guest

    Why not do something to soothe the tooth? A cheap sports style mouth
    guard would take care of any grinding or high contacts temproarily. At
    this point I would also be thinking of putting in an IRM (without taking
    off the whole filling, just where it's close to the nerve). You could
    say that this will encourage mommification of the nerve, but at this
    point, the nerve will isolate itself anyway from the insult by
    calcification. The original poster may even want to consider yearly
    visits to the ENDO to decide whether or not the calcification process is
    in danger of rendering the tooth untreatable.
    Cheers
    Stephen D
     
    StovePipe, Mar 6, 2004
    #20
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